Do you think my ds needs to be evaluated?
Moms View Message Board: Parenting Discussion: Do you think my ds needs to be evaluated?
My ds, who recently turned 5 & starting kindergarten this fall is definitly not your typical preschooler. I always chalked it up to him having different interests & being incredibly bright. But recently I've had two different people remark to me that ds should be evaluated. One even thought my ds could have very mild autism due to what she deemed abnormal social behavior & his intellectual capabilities. The other person was my sil,who thought ds should be evaluated for his giftness & was concerned he could develop social issues in the public school system if not handled carefully. Both my dh & I do not believe that ds has any form of autism or any other disorders. But these comments I have to admit is making me abit worried. For those who have experience I would appreciate your feedback. My parents have been watching ds until this past year while I worked. He is now in preschool. Until preschool he had very little social interaction with kids his age. Most of our friends have older kids. Though ds is naturally shy he adjusted pretty well. He holds conversations and loves being around other kids. He, however, is not interested in sports, balls etc. Will do it for 5 min and lose interest. He loves reading, writing, drawing and crafts and is very gentlenatured. The boys in his class are rough! As a result his bf is a little girl. He is overwhelmed in big crowds and prefers to play with one or two dks. At school and at home, he will sit & write/draw for hours if allowed. When we have friends over while all the dks run around playing together, my ds will join for 10-15 mins or so & then he'll write/draw/read etc for an hour by himself. My friend thinks this is very odd behavior and is the one who remarked he could be mildly autistic. DS has written about 30 books. He actually glues abt 10 -15 pages together to bind them; on the cover he has the title, "author by..." "illustrated by...", writes a cohesive story and illustrates the story. He even started a book of poems. He writes complete sentences with correct spelling and punctuation. He creates his own computer games on paper, actually draws a keyboard, created his own reading log and records what books he reads every day. When my friend comes to visit, 7 out of 10 times, ds is sitting at the desk doing something like this. We do go to the park, ride our bikes, go to the movies etc but when we are home and it's "open time" that's what he chooses to do. Anyway, what do you all think? Do you think he should get evaluated and if so, what kind of evaluation should he get?
My son is suspected of being mildly autistic. However because he is so mild, it is hard to really get a dx. Your sons interests are a lot like my child, but that is not what defines his "autism".
Autism is really a social retardation, kids who don't play like other kids, but specifically of how they interact, not just interest.
Key questions...eye contact, does he look at you when he speaks, does he look at other people when he speaks to them? My son kind of looks off to the side, or at your feet, it is not easy for him to maintain face to face contact, I have 2 other kids, they almost always maintain eye contact.
When he is with other kids do they play together, like here I will write this paragraph and you do the next? Or talk about the stories and have a conversation that includes the other person? My son will go on and on about his stories, but if you don't get to be part of forming his story, he will answer questions, but won't ask questions. He will play beside friends and not really with them in a normal give take situation (except video games).
What about rules and habits...does he like a schedule, does he world just go better if you stick to it?
When he talks does he pause and wait for answers, or is he more of a monologue person? My son ask questions, like do you think this should be blue or purple, but not on a regular basis. My other kids if they asked, they would say things more like, so you picked purple? why? I might of picked blue, because it reminds me of such and such. But then would go on to ask questions. My son will simply go and make it purple, if he bothered to ask..LOL.
Really what I want to state is that I feel like our idea of what normal is has become a very small segment. Kids are not really allowed to be unique in school anymore, they have so much to do. But if your child's uniqueness is getting him in a lot of trouble, then there might be more to the picture than that.
My son is also identified as gifted, he is unusually creative (which can by atypciall for autistic kids). What we have to really focus on with the school, and why we needed a label is. His different isn't always wrong, sometimes it is just so far ahead of what they expect. He has big issues with true and false tests (he will be in 5th grade), as special ed, they think he doesn't know the difference, but the gt teacher said, it is because he sees too many options..LOL. He apparently can rationalize any answer.
Your question, should you have him evaluated? Honestly, how is he doing when he isn't with you? Does he do okay at school? Do you have to be the first one to pick him up from places? Do you hear alot of feedback when you get him (like oh he is a handful, or wow he is so different, what an imagination he has, he knows everything about ..., etc). And finally if you got a label what would you want to change? For us a label meant he could get some special services, which he needed to keep busy and entertained at school. It helps him with friends and such. Labels only do good if there is something you see that he needs. If you think he is being successful then don't fix what isn't broken.
Hope this helps some.
I think it is possible people might be looking to assign a label since he is different from a rough and tumble five year old boy. Different doesn't mean bad or that something is wrong. I think autism is getting a lot of awareness, as it should but not every child who is gifted has autism or other disorders. Like Kaye said, eye contact and other things go into it. We went in depth with autism (i'm a psychology major) and I think they said most kids are diagnosed pretty early, like by age 2 or 3 but I don't have a source to confirm that I might be remembering wrong.
My son is 9, gifted and lives with adhd. An adhd diagnosis can be controversial and it made me feel a little better about it that I am the one who noticed it so the whole teachers and doctors want kids medicated argument wasn't an issue for me. You mentioned you really didn't think he had a disorder. Unless it becomes a problem, if it were me I wouldn't worry about it. You know your child best. Like you said he is very bright and has different interests it's possible that's all there is to it.
There is a lot I want to say and can't put it together right now... I'm tired and my contacts are dry!! LOL! I'll get back to this tomorrow. I blew off a lot for a long time with my DD, thinking "well... she's never been around children" or "she's an only child". I made excuses even though I knew deep down that something just wasn't right. Hence,she wasn't diagnosed with PDD-NOS until this year (she's 6).
So... before I start rambling... I'll leave the rest for the morning.
I would have him evaluated if nothing else, to put your mind at ease. The reason I would suggest this is largely due to what Angelle wrote. Moms are not really objective assessors of their own children (myself included) and the simple fact that more than one person has raised a concern is worth noting. That said, nothing you wrote screams "red flag" to me. However...there is potential. He likes to draw and write rather than rough and tumble games. That may be just a personal preference and no cause for concern. The question is though...can he play age-appropriately with other children? Can he carry on a conversation with his peers (not adults)? I work with a lot of kids on the autism spectrum--that's actually my WHOLE summer caseload from 3-16 years old--and some of the kids don't play with other kids for longer than 10-15 minutes because they don't know how. They have enough skills to start interacting, but then they quickly run of out things to talk about or the play moves to a level beyond them. A lot of kids with autism love being AROUND kids, but don't necessarily love being WITH kids and there is a difference.
First, I would recommend talking to his preschool teacher. What does she think? What can she tell you about his peer interactions during the day? As far as an assessment, I would suggest a developmental pediatrician, psychologist, or neurologist who specializes in ASD.
I do totally agree with Kaye that we are getting a small view of "normal" and it seems that we want to diagnose every child who doesn't fit in that box...and frequently we want to medicate them too. However, if he does have high-functional autism then his best prognosis is early intervention. Good luck with your decision!
Thanks Pam!!! You reached in and grabbed everything I was too tired to type! 
Yes, as mothers, our children are perfect, no matter what! As such, we tend to not see, or refuse to acknowledge, things which may be evident to others. I knew my DD wasn't as conversational as she should/could have been. But, it wasn't until I spoke to her daycare teacher (in a professional daycare environment, becuase her first daycare provider, though sweet and nurturing, didn't see any problems), who told me, as much as she wanted to play with the kids, she didn't seem to know how. And, she talked to the kids, but they were way ahead of her, speech-wise. This is what finally pushed me to get her evaluated.
If you meet my DD, other than slightly limited speech, you wouldn't think anything was unusual. She plays well (though loves to play alone... drawing, painting, dancing), has never had a tantrum in her life, makes good eye contact, no stims, nothing... other than speech. She is actually closer to Aspergers than PDD-NOS, but because of the speech, this is the label they gave, which may change.
Again... I'm starting to ramble... If you, after talking to his teacher, feel like maybe you would like to look into it... DO IT! Don't wait! And really, it won't hurt him. The neuro-psychologist who spent the majority of time with my DD made it like play! She had a ball! If for nothing else but peace of mind, do it!
And, as always, if you want to talk, we're always here. Feel free to contact me off board if you would like!
Good luck with your decision and DON'T PANIC!
I have a DF that is raising two of her grandchildren. Her grandson was diagnosed ADHD at 4 years old and they treated him for ADHD until this last year of school, he will be 12 in August. You see, people (friends, family, teachers, and even strangers) had pointed out that "something" just wasn't right. That he acted differently then he "should" and the grandmother assumed that this was "just" ADHD because that is what the DR has said and she brushed off the suggestion for further evaluation and blamed his medications for not working.
Last year, I sat down with the grandfather and we started entering in his symptoms into a google search, actions, etc.. We discovered that all of his symptoms pointed to Aspergers. This boy had been misdiagnosed and had been treated with medications that were actually making his symptoms worse.
Just a few issues he presented with, he can not interact with other children, he loves being in a room with them, as long as they don't touch his stuff and as long as they don't try to talk to him. He is the kid that presents that he has to have things his way, he will interact temporarily one on one but it has to be played the way he "knows" it needs to be played. Like trucks roll on the ground, they don't fly. If a child would make a dump truck fly, he would be telling them it isn't right. Even if they explain they are just playing (using their imagination) he doesn't get it and will become stressed out and stop playing. On a good day he will walk away after very little stimulation. On a bad day it could draw out a full out melt down.
He is very anal about time, if his schedule is put off by just a little bit, with out a day of forewarning, then he will start out by telling you that you are off schedule (repeatably, over and over, to obsession), if you can't make things get back on schedule he will work himself into a melt down. For example, if he is supposed to be in reading class and there is a special that day that prevents them from having the reading, it will mess up his whole day. If he is supposed to have a ball game, and it gets rained out, it messes up his whole day. It is as if he has his schedule in his head and if that gets messed up he doesn't know what to do next and it freaks him out. He will spend the rest of the day making comment and not listening to possible answers. "I was suppose to have a game."
He plays baseball, but he doesn't talk to the other kids on the team, he won't interact in the pre and post game huddles, he stands a bit back, he sits on the end of the bench where his one "friend" sits and will listen to him talk but doesn't get into the chat. If the bench is really animated, a lot of goofing around, he steps out of the situation, and watches.
Oh and he can put together huge puzzles with out looking at the original picture. IF you try to help and you don't do it in the order he does the puzzle he will actually take the pieces back off and do it in the order he prefers them to be done.
If there is a piece missing he will stew over that piece, talk about it for days, and he can't let it go. He will drive everyone nuts, looking for the piece. Literally spend the whole day looking for the piece, refuse (to the point of melt down) to leave the house until he finds the piece, unable to go to bed at night because he has to find that piece.
At church, school, and home, if something gets moved, he has a hard time adjusting. He likes things the same, new will throw off his concentration and makes him difficult for him to focus. He literally will move whatever it is back, if at all possible. His toys are all lined up, if they are not the way he likes them he will spend hours straightening them back out. He wears his clothes in a certain order and always wears the same pants with the same shirts. Say he has a pair of jeans clean and the shirt he normally wears with it is dirty. Those are his Thursday jeans. He will not wear those jeans with another shirt, he will have a bad day if he is forced to, to the point he has missed school because he couldn't leave the house..
He is a whiz with the computer. He completely gets lost. If there is a problem with the computer, it freezes etc, he wants it fixed right now. If a web site is down that he plans to go to he has a difficult time redirecting himself to another site.
He is extremely smart.. He reads huge books, retains everything he reads. Takes things apart to see how they are made, will try to spend hours telling you about how it was made, but it is like a script to him, if you ask a question before he is done telling you it throws him off. If you ask him to give you a minute, you are in the middle of something, he will stand there waiting to tell you even if it takes hours. If you don't see him for days, he remembers exactly what he wanted to tell you and he will follow you around until you stop and listen.
His newest issue, is becoming inappropriately physical. He will hug you and put his face in your breast. He touches people when they are in the middle of talking, touches and pulls back. Kind of like teasing, he will crawl up under a table and touch your leg and then rush out from under the table. Keep in mind he is 12.. He interrupts others conversations.
He laughs at inappropriate times and doesn't get it when others laugh. His laughter often sounds forced, like he is trying to immolate situations he has been in, but he doesn't know how to pull it off.
He is severally socially stunted. The other kids have a hard time dealing with him, they don't know how to interact with him, and he gets up set because he can see a difference in himself and doesn't understand why no one likes him.
I am not saying that this is your sons issue. BUT because of his misdiagnoses he was improperly treated. His treatment is years behind where it could have been. The interventions that could have started at 4 are just now being applied. He is behind where he could possibly be because the doctor only saw the boy that walked in the room, and his grandparents didn't know enough to see that the issues he has go beyond a behavior issue. Another issue is that the years of not understanding him, of trying to break his actions, of trying to make him "normal" have increased his issues. His behaviors have gotten worse over time, they are improving now, because of his intervention plan, but what if they hadn't pushed to figure out what was going on..
It is best to look into it and have someone that is an outsider assess the situation. You don't have to tell him, what they labeled him.. J doesn't know his diagnosis. He just knows he is different, that it is okay, and that he has to take medication.
I am so against labeling and letting it be an excuse. But I am also against not doing everything to find out what is going on. YKWIM?
Have him checked, nothing wrong no problem, something wrong the earlier the treatment the better.
Reading Bobbie's post led me to another thing... reading it, and hearing the symptoms she described. Even though I said my neuro-psych told me my DD was closer to Aspergers than PDD-NOS, NOTHING in her post described my DD.
So... just because you are reading this, or other sites on the internet and you cannot fit your DS into one of them, doesn't mean anything. No two kids are alike. I read every article on the internet about PDD-NOS and Aspergers, and my DD doesn't "fit" into any of them!?! But, the intervention she is getting is helping her speech, as well as teaching her to socialize. Like Bobbie, I'm not crazy about labels. But, they are a necessary means to get the assistance to the children. Call my DD Pink for all I care, as long as she gets the help.
And just a bit more. My son was dxes by the school at age 4. But even with that, it has been an uphill battle with what to do. Because each of these kids is so different, there isn't a set routine. Like with diabetes, you get a meter, you test your blood, if it falls in the numbers theyn you do a. A lot of times you get a label and they say okay, but no one really offers you services. The school does some. But I found it is just so lacking. The best thing you can do is get information and then research what you think will best help your child. Good luck with this journey.
I have no personal experience with this, however I just read Jenny McCarthy's book ("Louder Than Words") about her DS who has Autism.
She addressed the issue of the other boys being very rough and tumble, while her DS was always very passive, even when the other boys would push him around. She had originally chalked it up to him being a gentle soul, but after his diagnosis, she learned that it was part of his Autism.
Like I said, I have no personal experience with Autism whatsoever, but I thought I'd mention the book in case it might be of some benefit to you.
Ladies, thank you all so much for your insight into this. I am trying to digest all that I've read and working through each point. I am definitely going to get him evaluated by a professional. I will say that ds does have normal eye contact. As with any kid his age he is not always focused on your eyes as he's distracted by his surroundings but for the large part he is fine. I do believe that his inability to play for a long time with other kids ie. soccer or a particular board game is due to lack of interest and/or past exposure to the game. But as Angela says it is better to be sure that's all it is and not something more. I'll keep you ladies posted. Thanks again!
I say if you have any concerns, have him evaluated. It can't hurt anything. If it turns out to be nothing, you will have peace of mind. If there is something, then early intervention is best. And, the sooner you get him help, the better.
One of my girlfriends has a daughter with aspergers. For a long time she didn't listen when others suggested she have her evaluated. It wasn't until she was in 1st grade, and both her former K teacher, and 1st grade teachers talked to her about it, did she do the evaluation. I think she was just too close to the situation. Her daughter is now getting services, and doing much better in school.
BTW, I wanted to add that I am very impressed with your DS' literacy skills. I would definitely keep encouraging the reading, writing, and drawing as a creative outlet for him. My oldest DS has always been quite the writer and artist too.
I agree with Pam! Your son sounds very talented.
Joyce, do you think your son may be a bit of an introvert? We've had my dd evaluated and it turns out she may have some very mild sensory issues. Yet, my dd is a lot like me, introverted and extra sensitive. She likes other children and seeks them out, but then after awhile she needs her own space and some quiet. I'm like this as an adult, and the neurologist said she probably inherited this from me. Perhaps this is true of your son, as well.
Your son sounds like a wonderful little guy.:-) Having him evaluated may put your mind at ease. It helped me to talk to someone and better understand my dd and myself, for that matter! Good luck.
J's situation is extreme. There are more stories. I have known him since he was born and I have seen them struggle through getting him help. But at 4 he wasn't doing the things I listed above, and he isn't doing the thing I listed above as often now. Most of his issues occurred while he was on the wrong medication and being treated for ADHD.
Here is a story.. I get a frantic phone call from Grandma, she is on the way to the school, can I meet her there. We get there to find out that J's teacher was out sick, the sub had changed up the whole day, and J lost it..... To the point they called the police on him (he was 10, maybe), the officer shows up and he is afraid he will go to jail so J tries to run and he leaves the building, the officer runs after him and grabs him. J freaks out, screaming, and punches the officer in his male region. The officer bear hugs him until I get there and I talk him through calming back down... He was expelled for four days, his 10th suspension that year.... Did they give him intervention? Nope. He went another year with out being properly DXed.
Last year, he got an award for his behavior, and he didn't have one detention, forget an suspension all year. He still has a hard time with but he has come a long way in a year.
Pam, The funny thing is I actually try to encourage him to do more physical activities! He can do these things I've described above for hours in a day if I let him. But he does love playing hide n seek, riding his bike and just running around too. I do think he is naturally an introvert and it just takes him some time to adjust to new people and situation. My husband has no doubt whatsoever he is completely normal. His preschool teacher says he's fine too. It's just that he has different interest than the other boys. We had a special meeting last month because she wanted to talk to me about his abilities. They do a written and verbal evaluation for kindergarten readiness and she said that in her 15 years of teaching she's never had a kid do so well and that he's well past 1st grade abilities. Some of the things he does is mind-boggling. Like last night he created a word search game. The letters were lined up neatly and the actual words he hid in the puzzle were diagonal and backwards. In fact Pam, one of the words was PAM. I said oh you put in a girl's name in there and he goes "no mom, it's map spelled backwards. He had the words celebrate, animation ... He does it front me while I'm reading so I know he's not copying either. It's just amazing! My dh says certain people are labeling him as "abnormal" because of his abilities and so they naturally think there must be something wrong with him. I've called his school twice to inquire what they are going to do for him in kindergarten to keep him somewhat challenged. Twice they said their G&T teacher would call me back but nothing so far. His preschool teacher told me that Jordan is often distracted and not focused but she believes it's because he already knows everything and he gets bored. They are learning to write their names and phonics. If his needs are not met at school, he could start to develop behavioral problems out of boredom. I definitely don't want him to skip a grade because I believe kindergarten is more about social development, learning responsibility etc and Jordan is a bit behind than the others due to starting preschool this year.
|
Members
